What did Jesus die for?

28 03 2021

Most of us know that Easter is a time to feel grateful and humble as we remember the great sacrifice of Jesus for our sins. We are told that unless Jesus died we would have had no means of forgiveness from God. The teaching is Jesus died to satisfy the wrath of God against us as horrible sinners. 

But the truth of the gospel is Jesus did not die to appease God for our sins. As ludicrous as it may sound, God could have forgiven us just by saying, “I forgive you” because nothing is impossible for Him. The real reason Jesus died was for us. We were the ones that needed to die, not Jesus. We were the ones that needed to be rescued from the tyranny of a false self- story, the lie of accusation, the sin of thinking we could live separate from God. God loves us so much that He determined to reconcile us, to rescue us from the “hell” of living in the lie that we could never measure up to His expectation. This is the reason the Bible says we died with Christ, we were crucified, we were put to death with Him (Rom.6:6). We died in Jesus to the entrapment of our own self-centeredness, that we can make it if we try hard enough. Those chains have been broken! In Christ, we have arisen to the freedom of His self story, His story of freedom to be who we were intended to be. 

Jesus did not just die for our sins to make us acceptable to God. He died for us, as us, so that we could be free from the condemnation of the lie. God is not our judge. He is our rescuer. “You are now free to move about (your life)” *

*thank you to SouthWest Airlines

Also refer to “Was Jesus just a ‘saver’?”

S2 E2 God Where Are You?

8 02 2021


In this episode Dennis has a conversation via Zoom with his longtime friend Steve Fivecoat. (We apologize for the audio weakness). Steve retired some years ago from a career as a firefighter and talks about his feeling lonely sometimes when the crisis decisions where upon his shoulders. He wondered where God was but looks back and discovered that God was there all along. Steve wrote about his experiences in his book Rescue Me which can be found on Amazon. (Click on the title). It’s a very worthwhile and inspirational book. 

Steve continues to write about seeing God through his work and life on his Facebook page “Steve’s Stories” 

The author Norman Grubb can also be found on Amazon. The title Steve reffered to is God Unlimited


S2 E1 What Was Jesus’ Perspective?

14 01 2021


Welcome to the first episode of season 2 of The Jesus Conversation Podcast. In this episode we begin a series of reviewing the basic truths that give us the understanding of how Jesus lives as us. The scripture we focus on in this conversation is John 5:19. 

S1 E15 What is our Hope?

18 12 2020


In this episode Dennis joins Scott for a discussion on Scott’s blog post entitled “The Hope of Glory”. Dennis has just returned from traveling and is supposed to be following a 14-day quarantine and Scott is lamenting that his gym has closed all due to Covid 19. The question is where do we find any hope of relief from this pandemic? Is it with our government leaders who only want to shut us down? 
The conversation touches on other questions such as, 
What does it mean to have hope in Christ, “the hope of glory”? 
What is glory?    
What is God’s ultimate plan? 

S1 E14 What has Changed?

13 11 2020


In the fall of 2017 four men from the NWMC Knowing Jesus organization spent a weekend together endeavoring to grasp the future of our ministry. With a new perspective of our union with Jesus what would happen in our lives and how would our  ministry change? In this episode these men reunite via a Zoom call three years later to share just what has happened since then. Hear them talk about their freedom in Jesus, understanding God’s love, what outreach to others really should focus on, and how the ministry has grown. 

SI E13 Jesus Coming Again?

10 10 2020


In this episode Dennis is talking once again to his friend David Fulton through Zoom. The recording starts with them talking about the interesting corollary of Jesus coming as Messiah to the Jews and His coming “again” to the church. The question is, however, is Jesus really coming again, or has He already come? What do we learn from Paul’s conversion encounter with Jesus as to the presence of Jesus in the church now? How was Paul’s understanding changed and how has our understanding been changed through asking the right questions and seeing the scriptures through a different lens? What role does the heart play in seeing the revelation of Jesus in us?

S1 E12 “Praying to Change the Weather?”

24 09 2020


Dennis joined Scott Wakefield for this episode over a Zoom call to talk about the unprecedented fires in the area near them. Many people have had to evacuate their homes while others have already lost theirs to the firestorm. Scott suggested the reprieve in the hot weather is an answer to prayer. But what about those who prayed that their homes be saved and were not? Did they not know how to pray?

What is the real purpose for prayer?

S1E11 What Does God Want?

10 09 2020


In this episode Dennis joins his friend David to talk about the deep theological paradigms that continue to block our belief of Jesus living in us. One of the most dominant is the belief in the reward of heaven. Why be interested in Jesus living in us now if we get to see Him in heaven? The question is, what does God want, to take us to heaven or live in us now?  

S1 E10 Seeing Jesus In You

20 08 2020


In this episode the Sunday morning Jesus As Us Zoom fellowship discussed the challenge of knowing the truth of Jesus living as us. What can we do to better know this truth practically and experientially? We realize that much of the hindrance is due to the very teachings of Western Christianity. We need to speak and ask that God will open the eyes of our understanding to this reality.

By the way, we apologize for the pesky crow that wanted to be a part of our conversation.

Was Jesus Imperfect??

12 07 2020

“The Jesus Conversations” S1E9


Dennis is joined again in this episode with Scott Wakefield to take on a very controversial topic – if we live as Jesus does that mean when we make mistakes Jesus is also imperfect? We invite you to listen with a curious and open mind. What really is perfection? Does God expect us to be perfect?

We invite your comments or questions:



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